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Frame 15 Options
goddo
#1 Posted : 27 June 2019 15:39:14

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I have reached the point in the Victory build where I have dropped all of the bulkheads into the keel section and pinned down the lower decking. I turned the frame over to apply the watered down glue and immediately noticed that the bottom of frame 15 does not reach the bottom of the keel whereas all the other bulkheads do. When I was assembling the hull, all the bulkheads sat nicely flush with the top edge of the keel sections so I know they are all seated correctly and the 'legs' of all the bulkheads align to allow the deck side beams to sit nicely in the recesses. but if I deepen the keel or bulkhead slots at 15, the upper bulkhead legs will be misaligned.
My question is, do I glue strips of timber to the edges of bulkhead 15 and then sand them down when I begin fairing the hull? I do intend adding balsa wood packing between each bulkhead at front and rear as well, so this may help.
I appreciate that this subject has probably been discussed previously but some guidance would be appreciated. Thanks.
Gandale
#2 Posted : 27 June 2019 16:49:32

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Hi Goddo, can you post up a couple of pics so I can see along the hull. Would like to see the outer and inner hull if possible. I wish to see how far out we are before advising on the best course of action to put it right....

Regards

Alan
goddo
#3 Posted : 27 June 2019 18:50:41

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Hi Alan,
This is going to sound very lame, but what am I doing wrong when trying to attach photos?
I select the Reply button and then "Attach files to this post" and nothing happens.
Sorry, (from a computer illiterate).
Goddo
birdaj2
#4 Posted : 27 June 2019 19:19:20

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goddo wrote:
Hi Alan,
This is going to sound very lame, but what am I doing wrong when trying to attach photos?
I select the Reply button and then "Attach files to this post" and nothing happens.
Sorry, (from a computer illiterate).
Goddo


Goddo

You need to then post and what you will then get is the selector asking were the pictures are stored.

Always been a "feature" of this site that you post you text and then add the pictures after.

Tony
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Gandale
#5 Posted : 27 June 2019 19:20:10

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goddo wrote:
Hi Alan,
This is going to sound very lame, but what am I doing wrong when trying to attach photos?
I select the Reply button and then "Attach files to this post" and nothing happens.
Sorry, (from a computer illiterate).
Goddo


Hi Goddo, first question would be what device are you using to store your pics and access the forum?

Have you had a look through this topic, it gives a good indication of how to go about attaching pics so they are viewable to members without the need for downloading...

https://forum.model-spac...amp;m=264143#post264143

Regards

Alan
goddo
#6 Posted : 27 June 2019 19:27:22

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Gandale wrote:
Hi Goddo, can you post up a couple of pics so I can see along the hull. Would like to see the outer and inner hull if possible. I wish to see how far out we are before advising on the best course of action to put it right....

Regards

Alan

I think I have the hang of this now.
In the first photo, it looks as if the stiffener plates across the joint are proud of the top of the keel but that is just the angle of the photo. The stiffeners are sanded flush.
goddo attached the following image(s):
Bow end of hull.jpg
bulkheads 15 and 16.jpg
lower deck.jpg
Gandale
#7 Posted : 27 June 2019 19:48:40

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Hi Goddo, great to see you got the attaching pics problem sorted out albeit they are a little on the large side..... 650x480 pixels is the ideal size to use....

As for your build, looking at what you have posted I'd say everything is looking good to me. Your frames are all level with the top of the false keel which is exactly what they need to be. The bottom and outer sides of the frames will be dealt with when you get to the fairing stage of the build, some of the frames you may need to sand back and some you may need to add filling strips. During the fairing process you will lay a planking strip across all of the frames to assist in achieving a hull with smooth flowing lines, ie, no bumps or hollows. The instructions, official build and video build covers this process fully.

To help understand the fairing process fully here are a couple of links that you may also find useful...

https://forum.model-spac...spx?g=posts&t=19140

https://forum.model-spac...aspx?g=posts&t=5669

Hope this helps....Cool Cool

Regards

Alan
goddo
#8 Posted : 28 June 2019 09:37:04

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Here's another photo of the frames in place with keel upside down. I think you can see the discrepancy with frame numbers 15 & 16 in relation to the bottom of the keel. I feel that there will be a "dip" in the planking at this point. Your comments would be appreciated.
goddo attached the following image(s):
15.jpg
Gandale
#9 Posted : 28 June 2019 11:08:12

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I see what you are referring to but at this stage I'm still not seeing a problem.. It is quite common with these builds to find the odd frame sitting low and others high. It is likely you will need to build up the bottom of frame 15 and this is taken care of when you reach the fairing stage which I think starts at stage 20. Make doubly sure all of your stern frames are fully seated into the keel, it has been a common problem where the last frame moves when you turn the hull over and is not very apparent until you come to fitting the gallery. Once you have fitted the lower deck post up a pic of your stern looking square on.

Regards

Alan
goddo
#10 Posted : 28 June 2019 18:30:09

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Gandale wrote:
I see what you are referring to but at this stage I'm still not seeing a problem.. It is quite common with these builds to find the odd frame sitting low and others high. It is likely you will need to build up the bottom of frame 15 and this is taken care of when you reach the fairing stage which I think starts at stage 20. Make doubly sure all of your stern frames are fully seated into the keel, it has been a common problem where the last frame moves when you turn the hull over and is not very apparent until you come to fitting the gallery. Once you have fitted the lower deck post up a pic of your stern looking square on.

Regards

Alan

Thanks for your reassurances Alan. I will post pics (of the correct size I hope!) when I have attached the stern frame sections.
As a matter of fact, when I again looked at the photos in the official build instructions (part 2) I noticed that frame 15 is not reaching the bottom of the keel on that model either.
Thanks again for all your advice and I will be back, I am sure, with more questions.
Goddo.
Gandale
#11 Posted : 28 June 2019 23:24:04

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goddo wrote:
Gandale wrote:
I see what you are referring to but at this stage I'm still not seeing a problem.. It is quite common with these builds to find the odd frame sitting low and others high. It is likely you will need to build up the bottom of frame 15 and this is taken care of when you reach the fairing stage which I think starts at stage 20. Make doubly sure all of your stern frames are fully seated into the keel, it has been a common problem where the last frame moves when you turn the hull over and is not very apparent until you come to fitting the gallery. Once you have fitted the lower deck post up a pic of your stern looking square on.

Regards

Alan

Thanks for your reassurances Alan. I will post pics (of the correct size I hope!) when I have attached the stern frame sections.
As a matter of fact, when I again looked at the photos in the official build instructions (part 2) I noticed that frame 15 is not reaching the bottom of the keel on that model either.
Thanks again for all your advice and I will be back, I am sure, with more questions.
Goddo.


No problem Goddo, happy to help if I can and look forward to assisting you further when needed.... Happy building....Cool Cool

Regards

Alan
z8000783
#12 Posted : 29 June 2019 09:11:22

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As others have said, the work so far looks fine. There has been a issue with frame 15 right from the beginning so don't worry, it's not your fault. There seems to have been a problem with the laser cutting but no one has owned up to what happened.

The key to a good shape will be in the fairing, don’t skimp it. It took me 2 weeks to complete this stage in the end. If you are in any doubt whether a section is good or not, carry on. I divided the hull into 6 sections. Port and starboard, bow, stern and mid section. I also glued 3 planks together to give me a line across the whole length (you can use mortise and tenons for this). You need to use this plank to continuously to check each section you are working on and then the areas between sections across the whole length.

I found that, if any parts of the deck that were proud they could be taken back but, if the ribs were proud, leave them to be adjusted in line with their neighbouring ribs, not the deck which doesn't need to be built up. The other major problem I faced were ribs that were inset. These need to be built up before rubbing back again and sometimes they were badly off line. However, you cannot leave these as they will ruin the look of the hull when you have finished planking especially in the areas above the decks. In one example, it was so bad, I need to glue on a plank (after bending it into shape). In the end mine worked out all good apart from one small bump on the bows below the water line but that has disappeared now that I have completed the tiling.

She has a gorgeous shape to her hull and deserves much care and attention at this stage.

Hope all that make sense and helps.

Good luck






goddo
#13 Posted : 29 June 2019 11:38:55

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Thanks for all the help and advice that has been put forward.
I will proceed with caution and shout if something worries me.
As far as a plank along the hull is concerned, I already have some 1 metre long strips of 1mmx4mm so I am going to use those to help with the fairing, once I get that far.
Have a good weekend.
goddo
#14 Posted : 29 June 2019 16:32:04

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After all the advice regarding keel and bulkheads, particularly frame 15, I have reassembled the framework and replaced the lower gun deck. Progress pics below.
Lower deck in first three photos. Keel/stern bulkhead photos in the last two.
goddo attached the following image(s):
LD1.jpg
LD2.jpg
LD3.jpg
LD4.jpg
LD5.jpg
Gandale
#15 Posted : 29 June 2019 23:56:51

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Hi Goddo, from what I can see I would she she's coming along very nicely indeed. The stern looks good to and the final frames looks to be sitting in the correct position. Well done, keep posting and I'll keep looking in.....Cool Cool

Regards

Alan
goddo
#16 Posted : 30 June 2019 00:05:53

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Thanks Alan.
Markwarren
#17 Posted : 30 June 2019 08:59:35

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She is coming on very nicely.

Mark
goddo
#18 Posted : 30 June 2019 10:03:00

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Markwarren wrote:
She is coming on very nicely.

Mark

Thanks Mark.
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